smokey...

i just found this post on ql forums....


Sm0k3z

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IMHO, ProMode/CPM is a bad idea... i mean it will bring more new players and make some feel more at home... but for the players that are so adapted to the original Quake 3 physics/VQ3 it will be hard on them to have to learn a COMPLETELY new style of play... alot of them probably wont even take the time to learn it and just stop playing all together. thus making ID loose money on memberships.. the way i see it if the game isnt broke dont fix it. Granted there are a few issues, but the physics in Quake Live arent the problem.. If u want to play ProMode/CPM then get Quake III Arena and Point Release 1.32 and the CPMA mod and have fun...

/end rant.



That is the stupidest thing I have ever read that you've typed, and I am extremely disappointed that you not only are that narrow minded about expanding quake live. When you have the audacity to not only tell them to go play it on q3, but to get out of quake live, it gives me such a feeling of frustration i want to rip peoples heads off for not thinking with them.

Inclusion of the mod/gametype/physics would be no different than "freezetag"... just a seperate server with different gametypes (instafreeze, reg freeze vs cpm ca, cpm duel). The only reason I, or any other cpm player wants the mod in quakelive is to give a revitalization to the community... it wont seperate quake live anymore than it is already.

I'm sick of people being so close minded, if you really wanna play vq3 CA on dm6 or instafreeze on dm7 for another 10 years be my guest, but at least let other people play whatever the fuck they want and have the CHOICE to play whatever the fuck they want.

I don't see your issue. So smokey doesnt want pro mode and you do? That makes him close minded because his opinion differs? How many time do we go over the same things in forums.... 1 person wants 1 thing, 1 wants another. there is no right or wrong it's a simple matter of taste.

Personally I don't care either way. more content to me = more fun...but not everything added intrests me. I dont play freeze tag really.... I dont play much TDM... but I don't fight that they have it. But if I did.... I wouldn't be "close minded". I would have my opinion.

Nice to see that you did have common ground with him on 1 thing though...

Sm0kz wrote:If u want to play ProMode/CPM then get Quake III Arena and Point Release 1.32 and the CPMA mod and have fun...

rush wrote:but at least let other people play whatever the fuck they want and have the CHOICE to play whatever the fuck they want.

sorry to piss u off man... but i dont think QL is ready for ProMode.

an opinion that says "lets not have it in the newer game because it already has a dead community in the old game" is moronic, not to be a total ass but its not the most well thought out idea..

please try to find valid reason to NOT include the mod into quakelive.

there is no valid reason it should or shouldnt be there... it all comes down to ID / ZeniMax Media and the CPM right holders. if they want to calibrate with one another. for all we know they are in talks of it right now... You want it added, i would rather it not be.. we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one man.. im sorry.

The first time I played CPMA, I got my ass handed to me on a big silver platter. What's the first thing I did? I said "fuck that" and quit. True story! Although after a while I did bring my self to practice it a little more so I don't get my ass kicked so much. I think the same thing would happen on QL, they'd get there ass kicked, and quit, then probably come back after a few weeks and practice it, assuming they have a very small competitive part in them.

well i guess its all preference then

i prefer getting my ass kicked than beating a bunch of noobs.. and i dont like losing at all

rush wrote:an opinion that says "lets not have it in the newer game because it already has a dead community in the old game" is moronic, not to be a total ass but its not the most well thought out idea..

please try to find valid reason to NOT include the mod into quakelive.

Actually, that is as valid of a point as you can get really. Assuming I understood what you said, You think since CPM has a "deadish" community it would work to help that activity by bringing it to QL since QL has activity. It would bring a new game style that has a relatively small community to the forefront by piggybacking from a newer game.... Let's use an analogy...

That's like saying that they should start adding in every new car that is built, a cassette player since there is a few people out there that prefer cassettes over CD's. Ya, it may not be a big deal as long as they kept the CD player.... but realistically what is the point? Having to redesign, rework, spend money, and support something new to accommodate a fairly small demographic base in hopes they will convert or bring back the people to fill a hole in something that has lessened in popularity by choice....... that's not a well though out idea.

Again, personally I could care less either way... but more content to me is great. Add it, I'll play it.... I just like to debate

But, here is 2 reasons it will probably not see the light of day in Qlive..


1. ID has no ownership of CPM. They would not only have to track down, purchase rights to, but also maintain something they did not create.
2. ID has made it fairly clear that the only "sustainable" new content that will be added from now on will be for prem subs or higher.

I don't see them adding a mod to accommodate a small demand when 80% of the Qlive community just wants maps..... which costs them way less.

T@D wrote:
1. ID has no ownership of CPM. They would not only have to track down, purchase rights to, but also maintain something they did not create.

arqon was at one time part of the id staff, i'm sure they already have the rights to it

rush wrote:

T@D wrote:
1. ID has no ownership of CPM. They would not only have to track down, purchase rights to, but also maintain something they did not create.

arqon was at one time part of the id staff, i'm sure they already have the rights to it

Because he was on staff at one point you assume ID worked on getting/was given the rights to a free game mod? I highly doubt it.

Either way, I still don't see it getting added... but if it does, fun

T@D wrote:
Because he was on staff at one point you assume ID worked on getting/was given the rights to a free game mod? I highly doubt it.

he was there FOR the mod... then he just kinda disappeared after he coded xerp into the netcode and nothing ever happened

at the time of the hire, arqon was "done" with cpma updating. he was in the process of creating his own game, pmx, which was basically cpma that didnt depend on quake3 files. arq was asked to make the quakelive netcode just as good, and work on making the plugin flexible for different gametypes, etc. during the process he just kind of "disappeared" from the internet and hasnt been heard of in around 3 years, so cpma has been updated by the community since then, and the pmx project died.

rush wrote:
he was there FOR the mod...

rush wrote:at the time of the hire, arqon was "done" with cpma updating

If he was hired, assume that meant at ID, after he was done updating... then the mod was done well before he worked with ID. And from the sounds of it... he wasn't an "office" employee.... seems like he was someone that worked from home and sent in/did coding. They could always claim ownership of the mod if it was created on their time.... but it seems it was not.

But either way, if it's been 3 years since hes been around..... how will they add it or even be able to? If they can't contact him, they cant get the rights/ Also if the mod was created prior to his employment.... they have no rights to it.... going off of your time-line that is.


Again... add it ID, add COD maps, new guns, Borderland characters... I don't care. The more the merrier

the mod wasn't done... it'll never be done, like noghost

and yeah, he wasnt an office employee because id is based in TX and he is from europe...

how would they be able to get rights? i'd assume that since he's been gone for 3 years, while the mod has been constantly updated by a community team, you could obtain the rights from the new team. if not, oh well, but this isnt about whether or not they can, its about whether or not they should. i'm just here saying that there is absolutely no valid reason why it shouldnt be included.btw, your arguments seem really bad and invalid when you're taking one sentence out of wall of text, then using it as a point with smileys.

Well, if what you say is right that the CPM community is relatively dead then theres your valid point. The basic laws of supply and demand hold true if something is wanted by a mass majority... this seems to be wanted more-so by a small inactive community. Theres unlimited maps/mods/skins/settings/options they can add... CPM isn't the only one. honestly, I'd prefer if they added POW: Jail Break before CPM but thats just my personal preference.

As far as obtaining the rights... that can only come from the author or someone that has the legal ability to give them. Just because people have worked on/changed/updated/bettered the mod doesn't give them ownership..... but realistically, ID could make their own mod using the same ideas since Q3 is open source.... I just don't see them doing that really.

And like smokey basically said... if you want to play CPM then play. No ones stopping that. Qlive is not Q3 nor any point release corresponding to it. It is it own, stand alone, game. Hell, they haven't even added all the maps from teh Q3 PK files and have added maps that came well after Q3 was out of print.... some were even from the NoGhost competition I hear

Anyway... Yes, it would be nice to see something added.... but you seem clouded by "want" and not thinking about "can/will"

Your reasons for wanting it are personal taste. You want a valid reason not to add it? Ask someone that doesn't want it. Their thoughts are valid to them.

Personally... I dont want 80 GB of my computer taken up because ID adds everything people "want" to Qake Live.

all you did was write a wall of text about preference

here's the thing, though, really

at one point in time the CPMA community was easily 5x bigger than however big ql was at ANY time.. the main reason people dont "go back" is because of the stigma that it is "dead". the us community is pretty barren, but you'd be surprised at how large the euro community still is. the older cpma players ARENT going back because there is the "new" quake, in quake live.

what'd you get out of having both combined is a much more active cpma community, INSIDE the quakelive community

how do you go wrong?

im not talking about obtaining the goddamned mod, im not talking about preference

HOW DO YOU GO WRONG BY FOLLOWING THROUGH WITH THE INCLUSION?

you dont!


i posted this because I read "the way i see it if the game isnt broke dont fix it.". that attitude is fucking WRONG because the game IS broken. its NOT a matter of opinion or anything personal.

quake live IS broken, they have fucked up servers on terrible hosts, they have a piss poor site design (see: chat box), the entire community is bleeding like a stab wound simply because id dont know how to manage the game. if you add something like cpma, a mod that has ALOT of support to this day, and ALOT of the community has experience in it (not only playing, but helping out the development process). not only does your community and game thrive, but both benefit by the influx of experienced (see: not whiny xbox fucking faggots) players and maturity level.

/thread

What is wrong with their servers? I don't have any problem with them..

virtuosity wrote:What is wrong with their servers? I don't have any problem with them..

bad hosts are bad

rush wrote:

virtuosity wrote:What is wrong with their servers? I don't have any problem with them..

bad hosts are bad

Well I don't have a problem with the hosting or connection issues.

you specifically might not but i and a vast majority of ql players have

ya the routing to some places is horrid...